iDesign @ UCI

Welcome Message To New Students

Interested in Origins?
Join the club.


Mission Statement

FAQ

Organization


MISSION STATEMENT:

iDesign Club at UCI seeks to foster scientific discussions regarding the origins of life and the universe. Theories such as Darwinian evolution, intelligent design, and creationism will be critically analyzed.


FAQ:

Q: WHAT IS THIS CLUB ABOUT?

Origins! We are interested in discussing alternative theories to the origins of biological structures. While the current mainstream theory in academia is Darwinian evolution, we would also like to discuss other viable ideas, such as intelligent design.

Q: WHO CAN BE A MEMBER OF THIS CLUB?

Anybody! Students of Biology, Chemistry, Physics, Mathematics, Computer Science, Engineering, Anthropology, and Philosophy may especially find this club intriguing. However, you do not need to have a science background to be an effective member of this club.

Q: WHEN AND WHERE ARE CLUB MEETINGS?

Please check blog entries for time and place.

Q: WHAT IS THE MEMBERSHIP FEE?

Nothing! There are no membership dues.

Q: IS THIS CLUB BIASED TOWARDS ONE SPECIFIC THEORY OF ORIGINS?

Perhaps. Ponder the name of this club. This club is ideologically the mirror of another club at UCI, the Students for Science and Skepticism. However, our main goal is to give a balanced view of the controversy regarding the origins of life so that students can come to an informed conclusion themselves.

Q: WHAT DOES THE LETTER "i" STAND FOR IN iDESIGN?

Good question -- the answer is intelligent.

Q: WHERE IS THE CLUB CONSTITUTION?

We adhere to the minimum constitution that was provided by the Dean of Students. In the future, we plan to draft a comprehensive constitution and bylaws.

Q: IS iDESIGN AFFILIATED WITH ANY ORGANIZATION?

No. However, we are friends with the IDEA Center


ORGANIZATION:

PRESIDENT:
Arthur
Information and Computer Science

VICE PRESIDENT:
Brian
Biology / English

DIRECTOR:
Andrew
English / Economics



Tuesday, June 07, 2005

Infinity Pond vs. Pair of Ducks

Let us take a minute to ponder the graphic that is on top of this blog. I have enlarged it here:



This fountain is situated in the physical sciences niche on campus, between Reines Hall and Rowland Hall [lengthy historical sidenote: these buildings were named after two of UCI's Nobel Prize winners who got the award in the same year, making UCI the first public university to win two NPs in separate areas in one year]. This fountain is shaped in such a way that it distributes water into an infinity figure, when you look at it from an aerial perspective. Also notice the two ducks who have decided to take over this pond. I just happened to have a digital camera on me the day I saw this picturesque scene.

Now here comes my intuitive (a.k.a. hand-waving) argument for design:
1. This fountain is elegant and complex.
2. The ducks are more elegant and more complex than the fountain.
3. If X is more elegant and more complex than Y, then X is more likely to be designed than Y.
4. The fountain was likely to be designed.
5. The ducks were more likely to be designed.

Posted by Art at 10:07 AM

5 Comments:

Blogger cleek said...
so, were the ducks designed by the same architects who did the fountain, or did they hire a subcontractor ?
6/23/2005 10:38 AM
Blogger jqb said...
But we happen to know that the ducks were hatched, not designed.
We also happen to know that they evolved. Which means your intuitions
are wrong, as intuitions often are.

But far worse is the blatant dishonesty of the argument. Clearly your
belief that ducks were designed has nothing to do with a comparison
of ducks to fountains -- the belief precedes the comparison, and it's
the prior belief that justifies the claim that they are more likely
to be designed.

Arguments making claims of likelihood are generally bogus, and display
as much lack of familiarity with probability theory as with biological theory.
6/24/2005 6:17 AM
Blogger Art said...
Hi cleek,

so, were the ducks designed by the same architects who did the fountain, or did they hire a subcontractor ?

ID mainly deals with design detection, a process which does not need to know the nature of the designer. You may be interested in reading two different views on "sub-design" here and here.
7/01/2005 11:47 PM
Blogger Art said...
Hi ts,

Thanks for your insightful comment. Let me note first that my post was definitely not meant to be rigorous.

It seems that you are having difficulty with point #3. If we condition #3 on the absence of prior knowledge of X and Y, it seems that #3 would hold. So you say that we actually know a lot about X (the duck): that it came about through evolution. But is that an assumption or is it supported by the evidence? I agree that intuitions are oftentimes wrong (especially in probability) -- that's why intuitions need to be verified through rigor. But sometimes intuitions are correct also.
7/02/2005 12:07 AM
Blogger Art said...
Alternately, please demonstrate that:

- ducks don't reproduce, but are created individually by some outside entity


The fact that ducks can reproduce (unlike the designed fountain) shows that ducks are orders of magnitude more complex than the fountain.

- ducks don't vary from duck to duck and that said variation isn't heritable

The variations among ducks can be seen as a form of robustness.

- there is no competition between ducks for food, mates or other limited resources

Yeah, ducks need to survive and compete. But how does this diminish the possibility of design?
7/02/2005 12:15 AM

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PRO-DESIGN SITES:

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Panda's Thumb
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NAS: Science and Creationism


PRO-CREATION SITES:

Answers in Genesis
Institute for Creation Research
A.E. Wilder Smith
Reasons to Believe
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CreationWiki


OTHER INTERESTING SITES:

American Scientific Affiliation
Richard Sternberg


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